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The "S" or "8" Symbol: What's the difference?

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  • #31
    ^
    Spooky.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by 83kaL
      It's the House of El's symbol...


      So, If it's the house of El's symbol why isn't the symbol E ?

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      • #33
        Why can't it be both the \8/ and the \S/? I think that the \S/ in Kryptonian means the \8/ in Kawatche. The Kawatche didn't want to put something as obivious as the letter S in the cave paintings. Remember the legend of Naman has been passed down orally for 500 years and the caves were not found until Clark fell into them. Kawatche may not repilcate Kryptonian word for word therefore some of the symbols may be similar but not exactly the same e.g. \8/ & \S/. I believe that the \S/ is the House of El family crest. Also in the episode "Tailsman" Clark states that the legend of Namaan was never accurately written down and therefore it could have many different interpretations.
        Also in the episode "Transference" Lionel Luthor's cell mate told Clark that the \8/ means air. That was obivously the Kawatche translation due to the fact that the guy knew nothing about Kryptonian.

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        • #34
          ^
          I think the guy in Lionel Luthor's cell was good at decoding hieroglyphics. Kryptonian symbols can be considered a type of hieroglyphic to someone who doesn't know. It is perplexing to understand the difference between \8/ and \S/ because \8/ was actually embeded into one of the elements (stones). Well, if \S/ translates to Kryptonian \8/ symbol, and it was on an air element (stone), what does the air element stone have to do with the El family, or family crest? Why does something on an Air Element stone represent "Hope", or how does an Air Element stone represent the El family crest? Why were wars faught over it and cities built apon it on Krypton. Why would Superman wear an Air Element symbol on his chest?

          Man, this topic can get confusing fast.
          Last edited by litew8; 12-12-2007, 09:46 PM.

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          • #35
            Well, a simple way to look at it;

            He's going to be in the air when he flies :-p (if he flies...)

            My only logical way of thinking would be to look at it from the "Superman: Birthright" perspective.

            The \S/ logo there was of Kryptonian origin, and was a universal symbol for hope.

            I'll quote; "Entire cities were built on it. Over a course of time, it became a...a promise. A sign of people fighting to make a better world. A symbol of hope."

            So if we look at this with wider eyes, we could see that;

            1. Jor-El, being part of the "El" family, was accustomed to using the \8/ symbol.

            2. The Kryptonian symbol for hope is the \S/ logo.

            3. Jor-El wanted Kal-El to give hope to Earth, in fulfilling his destiny and becoming Superman.

            4. Raya's crystal with the \S/ logo was probably given to her before she entered the Phantom Zone, with Jor-El realising Kal-El may one day end up in there with her.

            The crystal was made for Kal-El, so he could see the symbol, and one day embrace it.

            Heh, there's my idea! Not bad for 6:45 am!

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            • #36
              Lolz i guess i'll clear it up for everyone...when Jor-el scarred the symol onto clark's chest he told him that it was the mark of his ANCESTORS, so it was an old symbol.. Over time the symbol must have changed from the 8 to the S.

              ----- Added 2 Minutes later -----

              SO the 8 was the old family crest but over time changed to sybolize air, and then the S was made for modern day.

              ----- Added 5 Minutes later -----

              and also just like hieroglyphcs a symnol can have more than one meaning.

              ----- Added 6 Minutes later -----

              and also just like hieroglyphcs a symnol can have more than one meaning.
              Last edited by ultimatesmallvillefan; 10-02-2008, 02:50 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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              • #37
                Originally posted by KryptonScouse
                Well, a simple way to look at it;

                He's going to be in the air when he flies :-p (if he flies...)

                My only logical way of thinking would be to look at it from the "Superman: Birthright" perspective.

                The \S/ logo there was of Kryptonian origin, and was a universal symbol for hope.

                I'll quote; "Entire cities were built on it. Over a course of time, it became a...a promise. A sign of people fighting to make a better world. A symbol of hope."

                So if we look at this with wider eyes, we could see that;

                1. Jor-El, being part of the "El" family, was accustomed to using the \8/ symbol.

                2. The Kryptonian symbol for hope is the \S/ logo.

                3. Jor-El wanted Kal-El to give hope to Earth, in fulfilling his destiny and becoming Superman.

                4. Raya's crystal with the \S/ logo was probably given to her before she entered the Phantom Zone, with Jor-El realising Kal-El may one day end up in there with her.

                The crystal was made for Kal-El, so he could see the symbol, and one day embrace it.

                Heh, there's my idea! Not bad for 6:45 am!
                So far the best idea I've read. Very nice. Explains everything.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by ultimatesmallvillefan
                  Lolz i guess i'll clear it up for everyone...when Jor-el scarred the symol onto clark's chest he told him that it was the mark of his ANCESTORS, so it was an old symbol.. Over time the symbol must have changed from the 8 to the S.

                  ----- Added 2 Minutes later -----

                  SO the 8 was the old family crest but over time changed to sybolize air, and then the S was made for modern day.

                  ----- Added 5 Minutes later -----

                  and also just like hieroglyphcs a symnol can have more than one meaning.

                  ----- Added 6 Minutes later -----

                  and also just like hieroglyphcs a symnol can have more than one meaning.
                  That's pretty much right. The "S" symbol is the symbol of the House of El. In "Quest," Robert Teague said that the ceremony he performed on Clark (when he carved the "8" symbol onto Clark's chest) was performed by the early people of Krypton, back when they were warriors.

                  So...

                  S=House of El symbol
                  8=Symbol put in use by early Kryptonians

                  Either TPTB knew what they were doing, or the realized they made a mistake and fixed it.

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                  • #39
                    .............

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                    • #40
                      I don't think the S symbol is the english translation of the 8 symbol.
                      because in the first superman movie you see all the men of krypton wearing these really cool foil like suits, and they all have their own family crests on them. Jorel had the S on his.

                      In season 2 when jorel brands clark with the 8 and says it's the mark of his ancestors, then that could mean it has possibly changed over time.

                      Like maybe, the 8 was the first symbol for the 'adam and eve' of that genetic line.
                      however, as the family tree branched out and spread, each family chose to deviate their symbol slightly in order to identify themselves, and allow for differentiation from the other families with the same ancestors.

                      That's what makes most sense to me, because the S symbol is fully kryptonian, and i think that the fact that it looks like the English letter S, and corresponds with the first letter of Superman, is just a pure coincidence.

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                      • #41
                        Guys, when Jor-El burned the "8" into Clark's chest (HOW many years ago was that? The ship was still in the storm cellar!) he said that it was the symbol of the house of El.

                        Later, we saw the traditional "S" symbol. First time, I think, was on the gadget Raya gave Clark to send people back to the Phantom Zone.

                        It seems pretty simple.

                        The "8" is an earlier version of the "S" symbol. The writing style just changed a bit over time.

                        Look at a printed "S" in English and then look at the way some forms of handwriting make it.

                        Doesn't even look like the same letter.

                        Same thing with the upper case "A".

                        With the 8/S, the frame of the two forms is essentially the same, and if you look at the "8", you'll notice on it that the upper loop has a thicker left side than right, and the bottom has a thicker right side than its left.

                        Eventually, the thinner side just sort of faded away and the letter came to be written in the form we know as the Superman emblem.

                        It's the same Kryptonian letter. One's an older form than the other, that's all.

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                        • #42
                          Funny how your image visualises your point.

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by hakavon
                            Guys, when Jor-El burned the "8" into Clark's chest (HOW many years ago was that? The ship was still in the storm cellar!) he said that it was the symbol of the house of El.

                            Later, we saw the traditional "S" symbol. First time, I think, was on the gadget Raya gave Clark to send people back to the Phantom Zone.

                            It seems pretty simple.

                            The "8" is an earlier version of the "S" symbol. The writing style just changed a bit over time.

                            Look at a printed "S" in English and then look at the way some forms of handwriting make it.

                            Doesn't even look like the same letter.

                            Same thing with the upper case "A".

                            With the 8/S, the frame of the two forms is essentially the same, and if you look at the "8", you'll notice on it that the upper loop has a thicker left side than right, and the bottom has a thicker right side than its left.

                            Eventually, the thinner side just sort of faded away and the letter came to be written in the form we know as the Superman emblem.

                            It's the same Kryptonian letter. One's an older form than the other, that's all.
                            And to tie back to hakavon's point, go back and look at near the end of season 3, episode 1 "Exile" as the mark of El fades from Clark's chest, it emblazes (if ever so briefly) with the top-left side and bottom-right side of the \8/ to give the more-modern imagining of the house of El symbol \S/. IMHO, the comparison of \8/ and \S/ does also tie back to wildenchantress_kt said that
                            Remember the legend of Naman has been passed down orally for 500 years and the caves were not found until Clark fell into them.
                            so equivalent to pronouncing potato or potatoe.
                            Last edited by dh1031; 03-26-2018, 01:07 PM. Reason: Formatting

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