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Loved It? Hated It? What did you think of "Crisis on Earth-X, Part 4?"

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  • Loved It? Hated It? What did you think of "Crisis on Earth-X, Part 4?"

    What did you think?
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    10 - As incredible as Victor Garber
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    1 - As annoying as Felicity interrupting someone else's wedding
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  • #2
    I might as well as review all the four eps here, because I kind of watched them all in one sitting.

    I got to say... this is possibly the best crossover that they've done so far. All characters were spread out across the episodes evenly, and the side stories didn't really dominate the ep they were in... they were simply part of the large overarching story.

    And the best part? It actually seems like this crossover is going to have a impact on all of the TV shows! unlike past crossovers, where they swept it under the rug and pretended like it never happened when they went on with their shows.

    It was sad that Stein had to die, but in a way I guess it makes sense. Had he lived, then they might had wanted Victor Gaber to do cameos on the TV show.... which he just couldn't do. And there's the issue that if Stein's daughter shows up later on, then she'd have to mention stein in some way. It would be super awkward if he lived but there was all those crazy reasons for why he wasn't around to make an appearance. the more I think about it, it makes a lot of sense that he had to die.

    The foursome wedding scene was awkward and the only thing that I hated. I didn't like that Felicity and Oliver had to butt in on Barry and Iris's romantic moment like that. To me it was just so rude and kind of egoistical. They should had just let Iris and Barry marry while quietly looking at each other, and then agree to marry each other at a LATER date. Then it'd be a thing on their Arrow show.

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    • #3
      I gave this episode a 9. It was good even if a beloved character has died in this episode. I has to wonder how this will affect Jackson after Stein's death. I guess that I has to wait for future epiosdes to find out.

      Comment


      • #4
        I also agree that this was likely the Flarrowverse's best crossover to date. In previous eps., we would kind of feel that either the crossover or (increasingly) the individual shows got short-changed -- when TPTB wanted to both do a regular ep and an "event" ep at the same time.

        This year, they "got" it in a sense. Like in the comics, if you're going to have an must-see event crossover spilling over multiple titles -- dammit, brand it as such. Smart play to brand all four eps as Crisis eps and not just, say, a Flash or Arrow ep that happens to be part of generic crossover. A viewer wouldn't really be able to tell if Pt 1, Pt 2, etc. was supposed to be "The Flash" part of it, "Arrow", etc. Barry and Iris' Nazi-crashed wedding happened on SG, for example ... and they were officially married by Diggle on LoT (More on the double nuptials later )

        It was probably as cohesive an event crossover that they've done, we had a real mixing up of all four casts and interactions we don't normally see, the plot threads largely were woven through all four eps. At this point, we all know the individual shows take a hiatus plot-wise and regular seasons plots get a pause button for the event.

        I too have had beefs that crossover event fallout has in the past had a hit-and-miss effect, if any, in the past on the individual series: Savage's temporal meddling, the Dominators, etc

        This time, some fallout is going to stick, including deaths (RIP Stein. Pt. 4 is the tear-jerker ep, FYI.) and the return of two beloved "regulars" -- in this case, Citizen Cold aka freedom fighting Snart from Earth X sticking around on Earth-1, and Earth-X's speedster being ... Eobard Thawne (I guess he was more of an opportunist than a true fascist). Wise move to bring him back from the dead, it never seemed right that they axed Barry's alpha-villain.

        Sara and Alex. I'm glad it's not going to be a thing -- but I have no regrets it happened, even briefly. And for all the fandom's jokes about Oliver and Kara's chemistry during the last crossover, I wonder if they ever expected that the two would actually be man and wife (at least, the fascist versions of them on Earth X). They beat both WestAllen and Olicity to the altar, though probably at some creepy Nazi ceremony off-screen.

        Other highlights:

        -Earth X's Prometheus being ... a dark Tommy Merlyn. Colin Donnell killed it as a Nazi Prometheus in part 2, even if briefly.

        -Quentin as a cold and deadly serious, goose-stepping officer in the Reich.

        -Winn as a freedom-fighter general, who (almost) didn't give a crap about family ties -- and definitely didn't give a crap about potstickers, lol

        -Earth X Oliver as their world's Fuhrer and Earth X Kara as his fascist wife/general. As dark as Herr Queen was as the Nazi top dog, Overgirl was portrayed as the committed believer. She was SS to the bone. It made sense too as she would see herself as the ideal Nazi, a role model for the master race etc. If I were to dock points for the 'fascist Olivara' arc, it's that on any earth it seems the greatest weakness of Oliver Queen is his heart, no matter who his true love is. And in Nazi Oliver's case, it cost him dearly. (How he checked out was a bit anti-climactic to me, though I get why he wasn't exactly going to get a nice prison cell at ARGUS. Dude was a Nazi after all.)

        And yes, all the emotional beats for the various characters were there, esp. for Jax and Stein's long-running separation anxiety arc. Part 4 was certainly the payoff for it. Alex trying to sort out her post-Maggie funk wasn't as good in comparison -- or in my case, I didn't follow/care about it as much. A solo Alex is for the best, both for her character and for SG series in general.

        As for the double nuptials:

        Barry and Iris got married, by ordained buddy Diggle (I don't know if he qualifies as a friend of the couple. Acquaintance, perhaps? I would think Barry is more familiar with Diggle's vomit than as a person.) I'll chime in and agree that the whole Oliver and Felicity shoe-horning their own instant-wedding with the Allens (West-Allens? Iris gonna keep her maiden name?) was just silly in the groan-worthy sense -- as was the previous parts' related crossover will they-won't they angst with Oliver's "botched proposal 2.0". So Olicity finally has a rock on it, I will say no more. They said their I do's and I've moved on.

        I will add one thing. I followed that Lois and Clark TV series and loved it at the time. I became less interested during its final season, which was when they finally wed, became a couple and had moved into their domestic bliss phase. Maybe some viewers liked seeing that cozy/boring phase play out for Lois and Clark -- I didn't.

        Both Barry and Iris and Oliver and Felicity are moving into this "wedded bliss" phase as of the crossover's conclusion. We could even argue that WestAllen's been in this phase since they moved into the loft. Food for thought.

        Not sure if the crossover entirely stuck the landing plot-wise, with the Nazi conquest not feeling as "epic" as it might have been. Would have liked to see some sustained Earth 1 conquering, like an equivalent of Nazi Germany annexing Austria, for example. It seemed that as a group, the teams could have readily taken them down together and keeping them apart was probably the only card the super Nazis could play with a hand stacked heavily against them.

        Anyway, I enjoyed the crossover for the most part, maybe the universe's first true event crossover in a comic book sense.
        Last edited by President_Luthor; 11-29-2017, 06:32 PM.

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        • #5
          Wow, by far and wide this was the absolute series crossover they've done so far, right up to the fact that it got its own special title screen.

          Dear God, Martin Stein. Of all the things that have happened since I started watching the Flash and Legends, Stein's death was truly a painful thing to see. It made watching this episode very hard, to the point where I was cutting the show off because it hit me in the feels pretty hard, and Jax having to explain it to Clarissa and Lily made it even worse. We all knew he was leaving the show for the last few months and at many times it was pretty much telegraphed that he might die, and the writers did not pull any punches.

          The absolute hardest and worst thing about it all is coming to the realization that as of now, both founding members of Firestorm are dead.

          Comment


          • #6
            Thought this year's crossover was a lot better than last year's. Sad to see Stein go, but I also thought his death were greatly performered by Garber and Drameh. I also appreciate that, after his death, the characters were given a few minutes to morn him. It's more than what we got with Han Solo in TFA. This isn't like with Caitlin's "we loved her" remark about Laurel Lance, this I could buy.

            The existence of a Felicity Smoak on Earth-X struck me as odd. She's jewish and lives in world, where the jews have been subjected to a neverending genocide for over 70 years. Yet, her family line remains unaltered from Earth-1's Felicity (otherwise, she wouldn't look like EBR).

            Not too thrilled about there being no conclusion to the Nazi issue on Earth-X. Yes, the heroes managed to prevent a Nazi invasion of Earth-1, but the Nazis are still ruling Earth-X. Countless people are still suffering and being murdered over there, while the heroes of Earth-1 moves on with their lives. In that regard, the whole Earth-X thing might've been too big for this type of crossover. It's something that can't be resolved in four episodes. The heroes can't fix that world (unless you'd go the time travel route, that I suspected that they'd take, after the first two episodes) in that amount of time. Even with these high ranking Nazis taken out, millions (if not billions) still exists on Earth-X. The population of an entire Earth have spent generations being indoctrinated in Nazi propaganda. That can't be undone over the course of four episodes.

            Also thought ending a Legends of Tomorrow episode, with the main characters of Arrow and The Flash getting married was an odd choice. It's something that should've been saved for episodes of their own shows (heck, judging by the trailer for the next Arrow episode, they'll be getting married again on there). Crossovers are one thing, but big developments should always be saved for their own show (especially as not all viewers of said shows, might be watching the crossover and the DVD's of each shows will probably not contain all parts of the crossover). Take Stein's death as an example. While he might've been injured on a Flash episode, he passed away in an episode of Legends of Tomorrow, where he was a main character (and the top billed actor). Which means, that when I buy the season 3 DVD, I'll have the episode featuring his death on it. He won't just suddenly disappear, when I rewatch the episodes. I won't be required to purchage the DVD of another show, just to have the episode, where he dies.

            Originally posted by President_Luthor
            I will add one thing. I followed that Lois and Clark TV series and loved it at the time. I became less interested during its final season, which was when they finally wed, became a couple and had moved into their domestic bliss phase. Maybe some viewers liked seeing that cozy/boring phase play out for Lois and Clark -- I didn't.
            Considering that the ratings went down (and the show got canceled), after Lois & Clark said "I do", I'd say a lot of viewers felt the same way as you. This does make me wonder about the future ratings for both Arrow (which have been low all season) and The Flash. If we take the former as an example. We have the pro-Olicity viewers, who have now gotten their happy ending. It's no longer a question of "will they or won't they". That question have been answered. So, will they stick with the show? Like I said, they've gotten their happy ending. Continued watching might ruin it. And what about the anti-Olicity viewers? This might be the final nail in the coffin for that group. If both groups stops watching it, Arrow might loose (at least) half of its viewers.

            Comment


            • #7
              I think the problem with Lois and Clark? The TV show was really more about Clark Kent and Lois Lane than it was really about Superman. The lives of two "normal" reporters were the main focus, Superman was not. So that's why the writers lost their steam once the couple got married on that show... because they weren't really writing superman stories at all.

              Compare that to shows like The Flash and Supergirl, where being a superhero is the focus instead of romance. So I think the fact that Barry Allen got married isn't going to put a dent in the ratings... I think that as long as they keep the focus of the show on being a superhero, that the TV show will survive. They just need to not let the marriage completely dominate the TV show, if you know what I mean. In fact, who says marriage needs to be boring?
              Imagine all the wacky hi-kinks that comes with being a superhero and being married to a superhero. the writers just need to be creative about how to keep the marriage interesting enough so that viewers don't drop out just because they lost the "romantic tension" plot-line.

              edit: and not to mention they also have other people on the TV show that could keep up the romantic tension thing to keep viewers interested. unlike Lois and Clark, which only had one couple on that TV show because it was all about them, and not a superhero and his team. The flash focused on other couples besides Barry and Iris in the past before too.
              Last edited by Aurora Moon; 11-30-2017, 08:41 AM.

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              • #8
                I won't go into everything I liked and disliked, but I will say overall that this crossover was pretty excellent by CW TV standards (not meant as a backhanded compliment, I genuinely enjoyed it). I think all involved should be very proud.

                One thing that did irk me... Felicity caused a scene at the rehearsal dinner and then also asked to get married at the same time as Barry and Iris. I realize that there were extenuating circumstances, but damn... Stealing someone else's thunder much?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Backward Galaxy
                  One thing that did irk me... Felicity caused a scene at the rehearsal dinner and then also asked to get married at the same time as Barry and Iris. I realize that there were extenuating circumstances, but damn... Stealing someone else's thunder much?
                  The dinner scene was just embarrassing and awkward, she didn't have to be loud. As for the ending where she and Ollie did get married, that would be a bit of a buzzkill but I'm guessing Barry and Iris were just gonna let it slide because they're all good friends and they just got married, too. They're nice like that.

                  I did like how in the Supergirl episode it showed Barry and Iris' happiness at being married while other people were depressed and miserable i.e. Ollie, Felicity, Alex, Jax, etc. The contrast was cool.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    This week I watched Thor: Ragnarok, Justice League and Crisis on Earth-X. My full blog post can be found here: http://doena-journal.net/en/1799/tho...sis-on-earth-x

                    What I said about Crisis was this:

                    Crisis on Earth-X

                    Trailer: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VK1ushRMsM

                    This is the first true crossover between all four The CW shows. Last year Supergirl had just changed channels from CBS to The CW and their episode only served as an entry point to the crossover. This year they used something they’ve hinted at in the (back then) cross-station crossover when The CW’s Barry visited CBS’s Kara: An Earth where the Nazis rule.



                    The multiverse has existed for the long time in the DC universe to explain when certain stories didn’t fit into the narrative of previous stories. The title also reflects the real-world clean-up of these storytelling messes, which were named Crisis on Infinite Earths and Infinite Crisis.

                    Plot: On Earth-X (aptly named: Erde-X) the roles are reversed. Heroes are villains and vice versa. Evil-Arrow and Evil-Supergirl come to Earth-1 to steal Earth-3’s Supergirl’s heart because Evil-Supergirl is dying. They also bring an army of Nazi soldiers.

                    It was OK. It wasn’t great. It wasn’t bad either. I’m just not sure why the Xers selected Earth-1 which does not naturally have a Supergirl (not one that has gone public that is). Luck?

                    The battles were all like old-school Command & Conquer: Red Alert tank rushes. Throw everything that you have at the enemy and wait how it turns out. You just get numb after a while.

                    The most emotional moment that I had was during Steins death. I actually did not see it coming until the firefight in the hangar. Then it dawned on me. I knew that Victor Garber wanted to leave for Broadway and his departure was prepared for within Legends of Tomorrow. But somehow I was still surprised that they went with the Retirony trope.

                    But they also should have ended the episodes with his funeral. The West-Allen wedding felt tacked on and even more so did the Olicity wedding. I’ve stopped following Arrow mid-season 3 so I don’t know what’s going on there but it just felt like a weird thing to do.

                    However what this scene did bring to the forefront was this: A story so concerned with Nazis and everyone expressing how they hate Nazis it was kind of weird that a good chunk of the black characters only had cameos: James Olsen of Erde-X was killed in the beginning. The "real" James did not make an appearance. Joe and Wally West disappeared after the failed wedding and John Diggle was just there to vomit once more and ordain the two impromptu weddings. So in the end the world was defended by good white people against evil white people.

                    And now back to our regularly scheduled programming after the holidays.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by DJ Doena
                      However what this scene did bring to the forefront was this: A story so concerned with Nazis and everyone expressing how they hate Nazis it was kind of weird that a good chunk of the black characters only had cameos: James Olsen of Erde-X was killed in the beginning. The "real" James did not make an appearance. Joe and Wally West disappeared after the failed wedding and John Diggle was just there to vomit once more and ordain the two impromptu weddings. So in the end the world was defended by good white people against evil white people.
                      I guess you're forgetting about Vixen, Vibe, Mr. Terrific, and so on forth. Cisco aka Vibe was there for most of the scenes across the four-parter but I guess he doesn't count because he's not black?? even though he counts as a minority. Then there's Jax.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Aurora Moon
                        I guess you're forgetting about Vixen, Vibe, Mr. Terrific, and so on forth. Cisco aka Vibe was there for most of the scenes across the four-parter but I guess he doesn't count because he's not black?? even though he counts as a minority. Then there's Jax.
                        No, not forgotten. That's why I said a "good chunk". And even of those you've mentioned: When did we see Vixen and Mr. Terrific? While in the actual battle, they too had only a small appearance in the final episode. Cisco was knocked out for an entire episode.

                        And yes, Jax was genuinely part of the story.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I do agree that it had that lame writing where they went: "Oh, and those guys were here too, just in the background."
                          But I have to disagree that they were entirely uninvolved with this whole business. They had POC women take part in most of everything going on throughout all the episodes. And Felecity, even though she passes for white and is white, has Jewish blood in her as she said twice so far in this crossover. according to the Nazis, she's not really white.

                          I think there's a good reason for this though in today's climate though. If they had the white people take a back seat and let the black people do all the fighting, then it would had been very politically charged due to things like BLM stuff, Alt-right stuff, etc. some CW shows and Supergirl had this past problem of being obnoxiously preachy about this stuff in the past and they've been working on fixing that problem. If they had the black people take more prominent roles in the fight against Nazis then they wouldn't had been able to resist being preachy about things like racism.

                          We already have some stupid people being upset that the Nazis are the bad guys in this crossover even though those Nazis obviously has nothing to do with the Alt-right, etc. Even though the Alt-right in real life is just neo-nazism under a different name and most people know that.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Aurora Moon
                            And Felecity, even though she passes for white and is white, has Jewish blood in her as she said twice so far in this crossover. according to the Nazis, she's not really white.
                            You don't have to tell me. I am German. The Nazis destroyed a good chunk of our culture-culture and science-culture with their idiotic "cleansing".

                            Originally posted by Aurora Moon
                            I think there's a good reason for this though in today's climate though. If they had the white people take a back seat and let the black people do all the fighting, then it would had been very politically charged due to things like BLM stuff, Alt-right stuff, etc. some CW shows and Supergirl had this past problem of being obnoxiously preachy about this stuff in the past and they've been working on fixing that problem. If they had the black people take more prominent roles in the fight against Nazis then they wouldn't had been able to resist being preachy about things like racism.
                            But they did not shy away from portraying both a lesbian hookup as well as a gay superhero couple in the same episodes.

                            And as some else noticed, Hank / J'onn was also missing. I guess in the end it comes down to weird mathematics. Wally and J'onn are superpowered beings but male. Felicity and Iris are not superpowered but female. So I bet while writing the script there were quota discussions about who to put in and who to leave out (Iris checks two boxes: black and female).

                            BTW: I loved Russell Tovey's appearance here. I know the actor from the British (and original) flatshare series Being Human. He also hooked up with John Barrowman once:

                            Last edited by DJ Doena; 12-01-2017, 10:14 AM.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I enjoyed seeing members of Team Arrow, Team Flash, and Legends against Metallo while rescuing Supergirl. The team with Green Arrow, Flash, Supergirl, Firestorm, White Canary, and Alex got beaten by Metallo because there wasn't enough metahum to an power. In this part, Metallo dealt with more metahumans.

                              Supergirl, Flash, and Green Arrow showed why they are the trinity of the DCU TV. I liked that Supergirl was the one who saved Earth-1 from Overgirl, but it was unnecessary to have Wells to tell her to fly up in the sky as she has done this thing before.

                              The double wedding was unnecessary and could have done without it. I'd rather Professor Martin Stein died fighting alongside the heroes and have his death be the price they paid for their victory in the climactic battle. End it with his funeral.

                              While it was better than last year's, it did not live up to its title. The ratings numbers were okay at best, but not great.

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