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#4.8 "Stop Hitting Yourself"

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  • #4.8 "Stop Hitting Yourself"

    What did everybody think?

    Edit: This episode felt like a bunch of filler to me, unfortunately.

    The only parts I liked:
    • Nygma impersonating Oswald
    • Oswald's mentoring of Martin
    • and Lee/Barbara's amusing reunion.


    Aside from Gordon being promoted to Captain, nothing really happened.

    I do smell upcoming drama for Lee/Barbara now that Lee has taken Cherry's place. That could be interesting, at least for a few episodes.

    I don't know. The show seems aimless without al Ghul being involved.

    I missed Bruce a little, too, even though it looks like he's back next week.

    This one just didn't do it for me. Not bad, but nothing great.

    I hope next week is better
    Last edited by Aries83; 11-09-2017, 07:20 PM.

  • #2
    A decent episode, but the big thing I wanna talk about is how Jim's promotion pretty much ended his relationship with Harvey. Part of me felt bad for Harvey having to deal with that guilt but at the same time, it's his own fault for ignoring his own partner's word in the first place. The ceremony with Jim saluting the injured officers was actually very well done IMO.

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    • #3
      I like Grundy, but I don't think an episode that focuses so much on him works. This episode should have been more about the growing tension between Jim and Harvey. It also doesn't help that the whole thing ends with Lee magically assuming Cherry's position and becoming lord of the Narrows apparently. Just when you thought the show was finally turning a corner with her character.

      I did enjoy the return of the sirens and the rapport between the women. That was the only bright spot in this storyline. My only complaint is that Barbara and Tabitha tend to flip flop over who they support between Nygma and Penguin. A lot.

      The stuff with Penguin and the mute kid was fun. It gave some great insight into his character.

      The Jim/Harvey storyline was handled well. While I prefer to see those two as friends, I think the show has done a smart job of creating a wedge between them by raising some realistic issues. It was easy for a storyline where Jim takes Harvey's job to make Jim look bad, but that wasn't the case here. The last scene also took his relationship with Sofia in a new more interesting direction.

      I missed Bruce and Alfred this week. I also missed Ivy, especially after hearing the news that Peyton List will be playing her in the future.
      Last edited by costas22; 11-10-2017, 07:02 AM.

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      • #4
        Was anyone else getting the vibe that Lee looked too similar to Morticia from The Addams Family in the episodE?

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        • #5
          *sighs* I was really hoping that Jim would get the captain promotion because he had done something to earn it, and not because he was sleeping with the mafia boss's daughter.
          We don't respect a woman who sleeps her way to the top, so why should we respect a man who does that exact same thing? The fact that Jim was already qualified for the job in some ways doesn't change the fact that had the gender been switched, he would had been called a slut for accepting the role that his main current squeeze gave him.

          At least we did have some excellent scenes that humanized both Harvey and Jim. Those scenes had you seeing things from both sides, and you were able to sympathize with them both on their viewpoints as well as understand why there was some tension between the two of them.

          the subplot with Ed, Grundy and the girls were.... meh. at least those scenes weren't too bad, and didn't bore me completely.

          Far as fillers go, it was okay.

          Comment


          • #6
            A decent episode, and really one finally moment.

            Finally Jim Gordon becomes Captain of the GCPD. It's about bloody time, after 3 solid years since he's finally getting moved up the latter.

            The acting from both Ben and the guy who plays Harvey, as Jim realizes just how far Harvey has fallen and is no longer able to be Captain of the GCPD then signs the paper was very well done. So was the music in that scene as well.

            Also watching Gordon and Harvey's friendship fall apart with Harvey going down into drinking more and such of getting him closer to his comic book counterpart, is well is hard from an emotional stand point of watching their friendship and Harvey fall apart.

            Which glad Gordon had enough sense to finally cut ties with Sofia at episode's end. Though this will come back to bite him, just like Harvey warned.

            The rest of the episode was just ok, for the reunion between Tabitha and Butch with the Narrow's stuff and Penguin with mentoring the boy.
            Last edited by Haggard01; 11-10-2017, 10:23 AM.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Aurora Moon
              *sighs* I was really hoping that Jim would get the captain promotion because he had done something to earn it, and not because he was sleeping with the mafia boss's daughter.
              We don't respect a woman who sleeps her way to the top, so why should we respect a man who does that exact same thing? The fact that Jim was already qualified for the job in some ways doesn't change the fact that had the gender been switched, he would had been called a slut for accepting the role that his main current squeeze gave him.
              As someone who has criticised storylines like this in the past, I'd say that circumstances had more to do with it than gender. For example, Felicity's ascension as VP of Palmer Tech bothered me because it was a result of Ray's infatuation with her and she willingly went along. It had little to do with her talent and she's smart enough to know that. At the same time, I wasn't critical of the Lois/Grant stuff on Smallville because despite the fact that they were intimitate, she wasn't hired because Grant liked her (as it was clarified in episode 7.08). And even if that was the reason and Grant was lying, Lois knew nothing about it. She thought she landed the job because of her talent.

              As far as Jim goes, I don't feel like criticising because it was apparent that he was very hesitant about taking the job because Sofia had lobbied for him and because Harvey was his friend. He only did it because by the end of the episode he realized that Harvey was too messed up to continue on as captain and because, like the Commissioner (?) said at the start, if he didn't take the job one of Penguin's lackeys would. In essence, he was backed into a corner. Mind you, I have criticised Jim in the past for being, how should I put it, too easy when it comes to the opposite sex. It's one of the things the show ought to fix with him.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by costas22
                I like Grundy, but I don't think an episode that focuses so much on him works.
                I agree. I did like how they threw in the flashes of him remembering Tabatha, though. It makes me wonder if "Solomon Grundy" will be a thing of the past by the end of the season, especially if Lee figures out how to reverse his condition? I appreciate the fact that they've tried to do something different, but I prefer Gilzean to Grundy.

                Originally posted by costas22
                the whole thing ends with Lee magically assuming Cherry's position and becoming lord of the Narrows apparently. Just when you thought the show was finally turning a corner with her character.
                I'm ok with her running the place, as long as she runs the clinic on the side. Otherwise, I'll be lobbying for her to get on a train and never come back, again!

                Originally posted by costas22
                Barbara and Tabitha tend to flip flop over who they support between Nygma and Penguin. A lot.
                It was weird how both of them seemed to get SO distracted once they entered the club. I was just glad they had Selina point it out...

                Originally posted by costas22
                I also missed Ivy, especially after hearing the news that Peyton List will be playing her in the future.
                WHAT?! They've recast her AGAIN? That SUCKS. I've grown to like Maggie Geha in the role. I don't see why they can't have just kept her?

                Originally posted by AsteroidMike
                Was anyone else getting the vibe that Lee looked too similar to Morticia from The Addams Family in the episodE?
                Her current hairstyle has distracted me since her return. Now, I'm going to think of Morticia (or Lily Munster) every time I see her in the wig...

                Originally posted by Aurora Moon
                *sighs* I was really hoping that Jim would get the captain promotion because he had done something to earn it, and not because he was sleeping with the mafia boss's daughter.
                No matter how you cut it, their past dalliance DOES cheapen the promotion. You could even question whether he earned it or not. I'd rather have Gordon in the char than Bullock, though.

                Then again, we really don't know what Sofia's motive for getting Gordon into that position is, do we? She said Bullock had to go either way, which makes me wonder: Is she Professor Pyg's accomplice?

                Originally posted by costas22
                As far as Jim goes, I don't feel like criticising because it was apparent that he was very hesitant about taking the job because Sofia had lobbied for him and because Harvey was his friend. He only did it because by the end of the episode he realized that Harvey was too messed up to continue on as captain and because, like the Commissioner (?) said at the start, if he didn't take the job one of Penguin's lackeys would. In essence, he was backed into a corner.
                Since he rejected Sofia's advances at the end, I'm guessing his job as Captain will be that much harder. I would've preferred they had him earn the promotion without Sofia's involvement, but—four seasons in—he should be closer to becoming Commissioner.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Aries83
                  I agree. I did like how they threw in the flashes of him remembering Tabatha, though. It makes me wonder if "Solomon Grundy" will be a thing of the past by the end of the season, especially if Lee figures out how to reverse his condition? I appreciate the fact that they've tried to do something different, but I prefer Gilzean to Grundy.
                  If I had to guess, I'd say he's going to be a mix, like CattleFish() Mooney: He will regain most of his memories and identity, but he will maintain his new look and ablities.

                  Originally posted by Aries83
                  I'm ok with her running the place, as long as she runs the clinic on the side. Otherwise, I'll be lobbying for her to get on a train and never come back, again!
                  I liked the clinic aspect of her storyline because it grounded her. And not in a negative way. IMO Lee's strongest point should be that she's a regular normal day character, as opposed to most of the over the top female characters on the show. When she starts wielding guns and acts badass, she's basically becoming another Barbara.

                  Originally posted by Aries83
                  WHAT?! They've recast her AGAIN? That SUCKS. I've grown to like Maggie Geha in the role. I don't see why they can't have just kept her?
                  Yeah, the news broke recently. List is replacing Geha to play a "darker" version of Ivy. I guess that's why they had Ivy drink those potions and undergo the transformation. To explain why she looks different. List could actually be a very good menacing Ivy, IMO. She has played similar characters. But it does suck for Maggie. She didn't even have the job for a year. And I don't think she was bad at it. She did the best with the poor characterization she was given.

                  Originally posted by Aries83
                  Since he rejected Sofia's advances at the end, I'm guessing his job as Captain will be that much harder. I would've preferred they had him earn the promotion without Sofia's involvement, but—four seasons in—he should be closer to becoming Commissioner.
                  Oh I don't know. We still have a long way to go in that regard. Assuming Bruce officially becomes Batman in his 20s, there's a minimum of 5 years left until then. Plenty of time for Jim to become Commissioner. It wouldn't surprise me if he even loses his job as captain in the near future and then wins it back in a more acceptable manner down the line. The shows tends to go in circles with his career.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by costas22
                    If I had to guess, I'd say he's going to be a mix . . . . He will regain most of his memories and identity, but he will maintain his new look and ablities.
                    That's what I'm thinking too. Otherwise, it's like watching a really, really bad version of Frankenstein...

                    Originally posted by costas22
                    I liked the clinic aspect of her storyline because it grounded her. And not in a negative way. IMO Lee's strongest point should be that she's a regular normal day character
                    I agree. At this point, I just want her to be like her B: TAS counterpart (and completely OVER Gordon).

                    Originally posted by costas22
                    Yeah, the news broke recently. List is replacing Geha to play a "darker" version of Ivy. I guess that's why they had Ivy drink those potions and undergo the transformation. To explain why she looks different. List could actually be a very good menacing Ivy, IMO. She has played similar characters. But it does suck for Maggie. She didn't even have the job for a year. And I don't think she was bad at it. She did the best with the poor characterization she was given.
                    That sucks. I hope this is the LAST time they recast the character!

                    Originally posted by costas22
                    It wouldn't surprise me if he even loses his job as captain in the near future and then wins it back in a more acceptable manner down the line. The shows tends to go in circles with his career.
                    You're probably right. He may he even screw up similar to the way Harvey did and be demoted. Hopefully, Sofia will be gone by then...

                    Comment

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