Loved It? Hated It? What did you think of "Nothing Personal?"

[DA_Champion]

I don't think that's much of an issue. Canada and the US have integrated militaries due to NORAD, NATO, ECHELON, etc. I think the USA also has a base in the arctic, but I'm not sure.

[KSiteTV]

I love that there's so much discussion going on in here. I'm sorry again with what happened to the original thread.

Funny someone compares COBRA to HYDRA - originally, COBRA *was* HYDRA and G.I. Joe was something called "Fury Force," about a military team led by the son of Nick Fury.

[Backward Galaxy]

Funny someone compares COBRA to HYDRA - originally, COBRA *was* HYDRA and G.I. Joe was something called "Fury Force," about a military team led by the son of Nick Fury.

Seriously? I didn't know any of that.

[Degobunny]

But why? To what end? To create order from chaos that they themselves started? To achieve power? Who are these people, really? How do they lure people in? How do they attract others to their cause? By paying them? They need a real, concrete, believable ideology, or they're just generic bad guys.



I think it is accurate. Just because Red Skull doesn't consider himself a Nazi, that doesn't mean much. Their simplified goals of world domination are pretty similar except for the way Marvel obviously downplays things like racial genocide. As an audience, we're meant to view them as Marvel's version of a Nazi party.

At the very least, it would accurately describe how SHIELD would view HYDRA. It's also a term an organization might use as propaganda to condition their agents to genuinely despise everything HYDRA stands for, and it simultaneously promotes SHIELD's valiant efforts to defeat them.

Control and power seem like good enough reasons to me. The Winter Soldier showed how non generic they are. Pierce honestly believed that using Hydra to create order was a good thing. I honestly felt sorry for that character. He was too caught in trying create security to protect freedom to realize he was destroying it.

I am saying this as an American. If you honestly say that Hydra are generic bad guys by creating order out of chaos they created. What does that say about the US hiring the CIA to go into other countries and cause chaos by assassination or selling weapons to both sides in a civil war conflict ect., and then going in and instituting there own ideas either directly or indirectly. I honestly feel you are oversimplifying Hydra, when it is a lot more grey and for me at least while watching The Winter Solider and subsequent SHIELD episodes has hit very close to home.

[SPOILER] we see how Ward is recruited next week so that will answer one of your questions [/SPOILER]

[Backward Galaxy]

Control and power seem like good enough reasons to me. The Winter Soldier showed how non generic they are. Pierce honestly believed that using Hydra to create order was a good thing. I honestly felt sorry for that character. He was too caught in trying create security to protect freedom to realize he was destroying it.

I am saying this as an American. If you honestly say that Hydra are generic bad guys by creating order out of chaos they created. What does that say about the US hiring the CIA to go into other countries and cause chaos by assassination or selling weapons to both sides in a civil war conflict ect., and then going in and instituting there own ideas either directly or indirectly. I honestly feel you are oversimplifying Hydra, when it is a lot more grey and for me at least while watching The Winter Solider and subsequent SHIELD episodes has hit very close to home.

I don't see the ideology in HYDRA. I see generic goals like world domination and the accumulation of power. That's not the same as believing in something. You have to believe in something to gain a following. HYDRA didn't infiltrate SHIELD en masse by bringing armies of people into the US, turning them into citizens, and then making sure they got promoted to all the right positions. Those people were already here and got convinced that joining HYDRA was the thing to do. How? Intimidation? Were they bought? Are they true believers? Believers in what?

What you're saying about America isn't the same thing at all. America has a very real, firm ideology. It's based around capitalism and core beliefs laid out by the Constitution. They often break those core values to accumulate something they need (oil, influence, etc...), but they stand for something that the larger population as a whole can stomach. What would HYDRA's Constitution say? Can you tell me that? I don't think you can.

Another problem that I have is Cap2 didn't actually show us HYDRA doing any of the things that caused chaos to begin with. They say they've been working to destabilize the world, to convince people that their order was needed, but we didn't actually see any of that happen. We also didn't see them infiltrate SHIELD. We weren't given any reasons to believe something was amiss. Heck, up until very very very recently, SHIELD in the MCU was about 6 agents, Coulson, Fury, and Hill. That's it. There was no build to this turn, a major flaw in Cap2 and AoS.

Order itself is also another fundamentally generic and fairly uninteresting goal. "I want money, power, and to create order in the world." That could mean anything from 'dollars, the Presidency, and marshal law' to 'stock options, Loki's plan in Avengers, and forcing everyone to get the same haircut'.

[Welling_is_pretty]

This episode was great (though not as good as the previous one, I thought).

Maria and she mentioned "Man-Thing"! My comic book reading heart pitter pattered.

Pepper on the phone? Nice.

May and Maria. Loved seeing these two together.

Skye's message. I was wondering if she'd left something somewhere. That was pretty clever of her, actually.

Fitz freaking out. Made very real sense to me. He would be the one to take betrayal hardest (as he did with Garrett). And he's already said he doesn't do well with change.

Skye taking Ward to place where she and Mike met. I thought that might be the place (whoops, red herring!).

Now they know Garrett is alive and Hand is dead.

May digging up the grave. I thought at first it was Fury's grave but no, it's Coulson's.

Talbot and the team. Man, Maria, be smarter than this!

Skye and Ward in the cafe and then hello Deathlok!

The talk on the Bus, and Ward saying his feelings for Skye are real? Ugh. And now I have a bad feeling I know where this is going. Fans have been equating Ward to Angel for a while. I think Ward will end up turning against Hydra for Skye and then rejoin the team or ally himself with them to try to 'redeem' himself and win her back. If so I'll be disappointed cause that will be really predictable!

Skye saving Ward. I've seen debate, elsewhere, as to whether she really does have feelings for Ward. I don't think so. I think she just didn't want to become a killer. Plus, this way she can put something special in the hack, which she did.

The face off a diversion so Phil could sneak on the plane.

Loved that they finally used Lola again!

FitzSimmons moment by the pool was awwww! Melinda back and the reveal that it was Coulson who was in charge of TAHITI. Not that surprised, actually.

So yeah, really good ep.

[DA_Champion]

Control and power seem like good enough reasons to me. The Winter Soldier showed how non generic they are. Pierce honestly believed that using Hydra to create order was a good thing. I honestly felt sorry for that character. He was too caught in trying create security to protect freedom to realize he was destroying it.

I am saying this as an American. If you honestly say that Hydra are generic bad guys by creating order out of chaos they created. What does that say about the US hiring the CIA to go into other countries and cause chaos by assassination or selling weapons to both sides in a civil war conflict ect., and then going in and instituting there own ideas either directly or indirectly. I honestly feel you are oversimplifying Hydra, when it is a lot more grey and for me at least while watching The Winter Solider and subsequent SHIELD episodes has hit very close to home.

[SPOILER] we see how Ward is recruited next week so that will answer one of your questions [/SPOILER]

US elites have a very privileged role and lifestyle that they want to maintain. That's their motivation. It makes sense, given that the level of privilege in the USA is unnatural. A lot of world politics can be distilled as certain groups wanting a better and more secure position for thenselves.

This doesn't work for Hydra because as far as I can tell they are not a cohesive group by any means.

[mbozzo]

'Nothing Personal' is a good episode. We get Maria Hill in this episode. We don't know what side she is now. Is she working for SHIELD or Tony Stark? I hope that she come back in season 2.