The Colt

[xrayvision]

So in this episode we found out what 3 more of the original 13 bullets that Samuel Colt made for his Colt were used on. Samuel Colt used 2 on those demons who attacked him and Dean used 1 on the Phoenix. When the Colt was first seen, 8 of the bullets had been used up & only 5 were left, and we know what those were used on. So now we know what all but 5 bullets were used on.

Another thing I was wondering was what happened to the present day version of the Colt. It's obvious they don't have it because they would have brought it with them if they did. I know they tried to use it on Lucifer in that battlefield in Missouri in Abandon All Hope but it didn't affect him. I think they ditched it there. Would they have gone back to look for it at a later time after Lucifer left that area? I don't know. It's possible Lucifer would have destroyed it since he didn't want it killing his demons, who were fighting for him & who he would need to feed on. But I don't think we got any confirmation.

And lastly I'm thinking about the Colt's effect on the phoenix. Wouldn't the phoenix have been one of the few things that the Colt couldn't kill? I mean the whole lore of the phoenix is that it's immortal since it always rises from its ashes. So to me, that didn't make sense. I think it should have been able to put him down for a while, but not kill him since permanent death isn't part of the nature of phoenixes.

[HowardFilms]

Neither should demons be able to be killed, etc.

His immortality was interpreted as coming back to life with regular deaths, the Colt permakills almost everything.

[Anno_Domini]

I think the other leftover bullets were used through the time of 1862 and 2006, imo, by Elkins. Perhaps the Elkins thought of it as sacred and only used it when necessary.

But, you gotta ask yourself, WHY would Sam and Dean bring the Colt with them. I mean, the journal itself read that Samuel Colt killed the Phoenix, so they needed to use the original gun, otherwise it would've caused a huge paradox. There was no use to bring the modern Colt back with them, imo.

And the mystery of the Colt's whereabouts is stumbling, but then again, perhaps there isn't really a need for the gun at the moment. They tried to kill Lucifer with it and it failed, so maybe the gun has just slipped their minds with dealing with monsters like the Alphas and the Mother. I, though, think they will end up using the gun with the ashes, imo.

And the Phoenix's lore of returning from its ashes were shown with it not dying, but it would just be a bit over the top if the Colt didn't kill it.

[xrayvision]

I think the other leftover bullets were used through the time of 1862 and 2006, imo, by Elkins. Perhaps the Elkins thought of it as sacred and only used it when necessary.

But, you gotta ask yourself, WHY would Sam and Dean bring the Colt with them. I mean, the journal itself read that Samuel Colt killed the Phoenix, so they needed to use the original gun, otherwise it would've caused a huge paradox. There was no use to bring the modern Colt back with them, imo.

And the mystery of the Colt's whereabouts is stumbling, but then again, perhaps there isn't really a need for the gun at the moment. They tried to kill Lucifer with it and it failed, so maybe the gun has just slipped their minds with dealing with monsters like the Alphas and the Mother. I, though, think they will end up using the gun with the ashes, imo.

And the Phoenix's lore of returning from its ashes were shown with it not dying, but it would just be a bit over the top if the Colt didn't kill it.

I was thinking, if Samuel Colt wasn't willing to go & shoot the Phoenix when Sam went to talk to him, what caused him to do it in the original timeline before Castiel sent him & Dean to that time? That part still confuses me & makes me think that they should have brought the modern Colt. You are right though---they had no reason to believe that Samuel Colt wouldn't show up. But once he didn't, the original timeline & that journal entry didn't make sense.

[Anno_Domini]

I was thinking, if Samuel Colt wasn't willing to go & shoot the Phoenix when Sam went to talk to him, what caused him to do it in the original timeline before Castiel sent him & Dean to that time? That part still confuses me & makes me think that they should have brought the modern Colt. You are right though---they had no reason to believe that Samuel Colt wouldn't show up. But once he didn't, the original timeline & that journal entry didn't make sense.

When it comes to timelines, you also have to think of what happened in "In the Beginning"; certain things happen because of what Dean and/or Sam has done...just as how Dean helped John in choosing the Impala, the reason Colt said he killed the Phoenix was not because HE killed it, but his gun did. I mean, it'd be damn silly for Colt's journal to say "a time traveler came to me with his Blackberry phone and wanted to use my gun so he could take a Phoenix's ashes and take it back into the 21st century", lol...that'd be like Joseph Smith doucheyness.

[xrayvision]

When it comes to timelines, you also have to think of what happened in "In the Beginning"; certain things happen because of what Dean and/or Sam has done...just as how Dean helped John in choosing the Impala, the reason Colt said he killed the Phoenix was not because HE killed it, but his gun did. I mean, it'd be damn silly for Colt's journal to say "a time traveler came to me with his Blackberry phone and wanted to use my gun so he could take a Phoenix's ashes and take it back into the 21st century", lol...that'd be like Joseph Smith doucheyness.

So I guess Supernatural does time travel like the Bill & Ted movies where if someone time travels to a specific moment, a version of them will always be there in that moment. So I guess back when 1861 would be considered the present day, a future Sam showed up & got the Colt from Samuel Colt & gave it to Dean to kill the Phoenix.

How do you suppose Samuel Colt knew it was a Phoenix so he could identify it as such in his journal? Do you think Sam told him offscreen? I don't remember Sam identifying the thing he was hunting as a Phoenix in that scene where he spoke to Colt.

Also, do you think Samuel himself ever read that journal? I'm sure at least someone in the Campbell family, like the one who set up that library, read it. Because if I remember correctly, in In The Beginning he thought the gun was just a legend until Dean showed up with it. I don't think he would have thought of it like that if he actually read Colt's own journal and found writings of it in there.

[Anno_Domini]

So I guess Supernatural does time travel like the Bill & Ted movies where if someone time travels to a specific moment, a version of them will always be there in that moment. So I guess back when 1861 would be considered the present day, a future Sam showed up & got the Colt from Samuel Colt & gave it to Dean to kill the Phoenix.

Pretty much. I think in 1973 there will always be a Dean to get John into buying the Impala, as well in 1978 there will always be the archangel Michael to erase the minds of John and Mary on the events of Anna trying to kill Mary.

Time is fluid, so once something is taken in place, I think it stays there(Castiel said 'time is fluid' in ITB).

How do you suppose Samuel Colt knew it was a Phoenix so he could identify it as such in his journal? Do you think Sam told him offscreen? I don't remember Sam identifying the thing he was hunting as a Phoenix in that scene where he spoke to Colt.

I thought Sam mentioned he was hunting a Phoenix? If not, then maybe Samuel Colt knew it was a Phoenix from the ashes(so far, we haven't seen any other monsters that turn into ashes). And, also, so far, we are not in the ware of any other monster than can be used to kill another, so once Sam mentioned he needs the ashes(which I know he did) to kill another thing, perhaps Colt already identified the ashes are of a Phoenix.

Also, do you think Samuel himself ever read that journal? I'm sure at least someone in the Campbell family, like the one who set up that library, read it. Because if I remember correctly, in In The Beginning he thought the gun was just a legend until Dean showed up with it. I don't think he would have thought of it like that if he actually read Colt's own journal and found writings of it in there.

You have to also wonder though, even though Samuel Campbell had the journal back then, he probably still thought the gun was legend and probably didn't even consider such a gun still to be around 100+ years after its creation.

I hope Colt didn't read the journal though. It's just like copying something else; granted, it's the same guy's stuff, but to know what he wrote from then on and wonder how he would've felt when the writings stopped(which I assumed before he went off to war and obviously when he died). That would suck

[ChrisB85]

Okay, just rewatched the EP and thus came up with some answers about what has been said and what not.

1. When Dean ready Coltīs Journal it says "Gun killed a Pheonix today. Left a pile of smoldering ash." So Colt never wrote HE killed a Pheonix, but only that a pheonix was killed with his gun.

2. In Coltīs cabin the conversation goes like:
Sam: "I need your help killing a pheonix."
Colt: "So they exist?"
Sam: "Yeah and youīll shoot one in about three hours."

[Anno_Domini]

Knew the part about what the journal said and I thought Sam mentioned the Phoenix, so good to know.

Anywho...we now know the three of six bullets that was used before the Colt was hidden away for some amount of time.

I'd like to see the Colt being used between the time of Samuel Colt and Daniel Elkins, imo. Maybe in the early 20th century and Sam and Dean end up having to help out an Elkins family member(I assume the Colt has been brought down from Elkins to Elkins after Colt gave it away).