This means Sam will be Michael's &/or Lucifer's new 1st demon! It means 2 Sams!

[xrayvision]

Did Famine say he had no soul, or did Famine say his soul was just "empty"?

I think Sam's storyline is that his soul is missing just because they want to do something different than having Sam being down in the dumps as Dean was in season four.

And, even if Sam's soul is in Hell, I can't say that Sam's soul will become a demon just because Bobby made it seem like someone has to be in Hell for at least a couple hundred years, and right now, Sam's soul has only been in Hell for about 120-ish years.

And for the fact that, Dean's soul was in a torturing area within Hell, but as of yet, Sam was in a cage. I don't see how he could be on a rack and tortured as Dean was.

Even though they call it a cage, I don't think it's to be taken literally. By cage, I'd say they mean a closed off part of hell that nobody else can get to (no escape, which is the purpose of a cage) & not necessarily a small confined space.

Also, I have to think that under normal conditions where a demon torturing another soul on a rack would take longer. But this is Lucifer AND Michael too, who are exponentially stronger than even the strongest demon. I'd have to think that whatever just 1 of them (nevermind both) could do to Sam would cause the transformation to go a lot quicker than the torture & pain Alistair & demons like him dealt to the souls in hell before he was killed.

I am liking the theory with Raphael having Sam's soul just because for right now, I don't believe Adam is anywhere near Raphael's plan. I think it's just Raphael trying to release Michael and Lucifer out and finally getting Sam and Dean to accept their destinies.

I am intrigued on how Raphael plans on opening Lucifer's cage though.

If Sam's soul is in Heaven trapped by Raphael somewhere, then I think the #1 reason it would happen is because it would be totally unlike the events that happened with Lilith becoming Lucifer's first demon. Maybe the bizarre events of the season will continue so that Sam's soul is tortured by the angels in Heaven & turns into a demon or some entirely new entity that is more powerful than any demon & is almost as powerful as an archangel.

For the Sam in hell becoming the next Lilith type superdemon theory, it would be something like what happened with Lilith, but here we would be more attached since it's Sam Winchester's soul turning into a demon and because of the possibility that Michael could be the one turning him into a demon, which would be totally different than what happened before since Michael was always the obedient one.

What I'm hoping for is for Sam's soul to be in hell & for not only the Winchesters to get a nasty surprise when they realize Sam's soul turned into a demon, but also for Raphael to get the worst surprise of all when he opens the cage & realizes that Michael is on board with Lucifer & both want to end the world. Now that would be an explosive plot & one that finally would get all the angels of Heaven on the same side as the Winchesters.

As for Raphael opening the cage, he would have to do it by using the rings that Dean & Sam collected from the Horsemen. Castiel took them & Raphael could still get his hands on them. Then again, it seems like the opening to the "cage" in hell created by the rings is a one way opening where you can enter but not escape (not without God interfering). So maybe new seals or a single new seal would have to be broken. If Sera said a new mythology is being written, then maybe part of the mythology will involve the breaking of the new singular seal as "when he whose soul-turned demon merges with his body and breaks the natural order, then so shall it break". If that were to happen, Sam would be the only demon who was to ever merge with his actual body since every other demons' bodies had long rotted before they broke out of hell. So for this, the Sam in hell theory also works for the better.

----- Added 6 Minutes later -----

yeah, thats sort of what i was thinking. i mean, we dont know what michael's orders from god are, but one of them is probably not to mess with humans/human souls, if so, then we have to wonder wether or not he will still follow orders. so even if sams saoul is in hell, who say michael will torture it?

That all depends on Michael. If he remains to be loyal, then he will protect Sam's soul from Lucifer while in hell. If not, then man oh man, things will get very, very bleak. Sam's soul would become a demon, if not already, then very soon. And Michael & Lucifer would be partners in ending the world & declaring war on Heaven. Eventually, God would likely get involved because everything would become pure chaos & destruction. It would however bring every angel, demon & monster the Winchesters ever fought together to unite & stop the ending of the world. And if that is the main plan God had all along, there would be a HUGE payoff.

----- Added 9 Minutes later -----

then if it did get back into his human body it would probably be really realy bad.

Yup. I'd say it would be the "breaking of the one & only seal" level bad (I think there will be only 1 seal to break the next time someone tries to break Lucifer & Michael out). And Sam would probably make Jesse & his powers look like a bug. He would be the 1st demon to ever wear his own original body as a meatsuit.

Also think about it like this---if Lilith was Lucifer's first demon & one he made all on his own before getting locked in the cage & one who was as powerful as she was, then who knows how strong Sam would be if the 2 most powerful archangels in the show combine their efforts & turn him into the all time Alpha demon. He would make Lilith's powers look like nothing.

[Anno_Domini]

Even though they call it a cage, I don't think it's to be taken literally. By cage, I'd say they mean a closed off part of hell that nobody else can get to (no escape, which is the purpose of a cage) & not necessarily a small confined space.

Also, I have to think that under normal conditions where a demon torturing another soul on a rack would take longer. But this is Lucifer AND Michael too, who are exponentially stronger than even the strongest demon. I'd have to think that whatever just 1 of them (nevermind both) could do to Sam would cause the transformation to go a lot quicker than the torture & pain Alistair & demons like him dealt to the souls in hell before he was killed.

I think the 'Lucifer's Cage' term is very literal as even the angels called it a cage, plus, if we take anything from the tenth episode's title, "Caged Heat", it could definitely show Sam inside such a cage.

And I don't think we should jump to conclusions with Lucifer and Michael wanting to create a demon as Michael could still be a "good guy" whenever he does come out of the cage. We shouldn't jump to conclusions and say Michael will decide to team up with Lucifer as he saw Lucifer as a monster. And also, if both angels were to decide to torture a soul, or even could as I still don't think they could as well as someone like Alastair, it would still need to take at least another hundred years or so. Like I said before, Bobby mentioned how a soul needs to be tortured for an amount of time first.

If Sam's soul is in Heaven trapped by Raphael somewhere, then I think the #1 reason it would happen is because it would be totally unlike the events that happened with Lilith becoming Lucifer's first demon. Maybe the bizarre events of the season will continue so that Sam's soul is tortured by the angels in Heaven & turns into a demon or some entirely new entity that is more powerful than any demon & is almost as powerful as an archangel.

For the Sam in hell becoming the next Lilith type superdemon theory, it would be something like what happened with Lilith, but here we would be more attached since it's Sam Winchester's soul turning into a demon and because of the possibility that Michael could be the one turning him into a demon, which would be totally different than what happened before since Michael was always the obedient one.

What I'm hoping for is for Sam's soul to be in hell & for not only the Winchesters to get a nasty surprise when they realize Sam's soul turned into a demon, but also for Raphael to get the worst surprise of all when he opens the cage & realizes that Michael is on board with Lucifer & both want to end the world. Now that would be an explosive plot & one that finally would get all the angels of Heaven on the same side as the Winchesters.

As for Raphael opening the cage, he would have to do it by using the rings that Dean & Sam collected from the Horsemen. Castiel took them & Raphael could still get his hands on them. Then again, it seems like the opening to the "cage" in hell created by the rings is a one way opening where you can enter but not escape (not without God interfering). So maybe new seals or a single new seal would have to be broken. If Sera said a new mythology is being written, then maybe part of the mythology will involve the breaking of the new singular seal as "when he whose soul-turned demon merges with his body and breaks the natural order, then so shall it break". If that were to happen, Sam would be the only demon who was to ever merge with his actual body since every other demons' bodies had long rotted before they broke out of hell. So for this, the Sam in hell theory also works for the better.

That's just way too much, lol.

I don't think Sam will become a superdemon mostly because they are trying to stray away from demons all around, and it'll more than likely just be a simple answer and will resolve quickly with Sam obtaining his soul. I would, though, prefer the Alphas wanting to use Sam's soulless body as a leader for their armies. It would just stick more to the storyline of this episode than to bring in another major demon besides Crowley.

And as for who took the rings, we never saw who took them so I don't think it's a safe bet to say Castiel has them. Or, if he were to take them, he could have hid them, or perhaps he stored them with God's weapons and Balthazar could have stolen them. But it's still up in the air; Dean could have even kept them.